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Report 581
Report #581 Skillset: Music Skill: DiscordantChord Org: Spiritsingers Status: Rejected Apr 2011 Furies' Decision: We do not find this to be necessary. Problem: DiscordantChord is an 'end-point' in the auric line of afflictions, aiming to reward the sustaining of all four aurics and octave upon a target. It deals damage that scales linearly based on the presence of these on the target, plus a stun and mana/ego drain should all be present. However, in its current form, the result in no way reflects the difficulty and cost (full=16p) of setup and execution. Solution #1: The mana/ego drain from DiscordantChord do not trigger damage via manabarbs or egovice (and is possibly the only decrease of these stats ingame that does not). Thus, allow the mana and ego drain from a fully powered Discordantchord to trigger damage via manabarbs and egovice. Solution #2: Keeping in mind that there is no method by which a bard may track the presence of aurics upon a target, allow a fully powered DiscordantChord to instantly kill the target. Player Comments: ---on 3/8 @ 17:56 writes: I would support either solution. I am assuming you're counting up the power as 3 for octave 3 for pfifth 2 for powerspikes and 8 for the actual chord. The current effect is definitely lacking for all the build up and power required. More often than not, when I do reach the point where I could do a full chord, I don't have 8p, and by the time I do they've cured off. Pulling off a full DiscordantChord is fairly rare. My concern is on groups - it becomes a lot easier to pull off in the case of multiple bards. Granted, bards can already support each other for deathsongs, but this would be faster than the timed insta if well executed, especially taking into account vivace and eq bonuses. I think that the pfifth and the octave should be mechanically required conditions for either solution (as now, they're practical requirements, but with groups that becomes less true). ---on 3/8 @ 18:10 writes: I'm going to have to disagree with solution 1. The DiscordantChord does considerable damage to a person with all the auric afflictions in addition to the ego and mana loss. If it were made to be affected by manabarbs and egovice, a person would be dead quite easily, probably without even the full set of auric afflictions. Testing to obtain actual numbers might be good, too. ---on 3/8 @ 21:06 writes: To give you numbers here is my prompt directly following a full chord (magicproof on splendours, tome): 4534h, 4554m, 5727e, 10p, 21880en, 30835w xkp<>- <15:45:41.232> -2130h -4554m -5451e. It reduces mana and ego by 1/2 of your max in addition to the punch to health and a brief stun. Unfortunately, unless ego and mana drain are effected by barbs, these drains are useless to a bard - in fact, they can hurt us, since if someone runs out of mana or ego, our minorsixths will do no damage. The first solution is a not a guaranteed instakill. It would kill me, but it probably wouldn't kill a surged warrior, nor races with lower int/con. It also won't kill someone with mana/ego already reduced below half, the mana/ego won't be their to drain. ---on 3/8 @ 21:10 writes: There* to drain. The point is, that 'considerable damage' is a matter of perspective. 2k is a lot I'll grant you, but for 10p? (+3 octave +3 pfifth) it's kind of pathetic. ---on 3/9 @ 05:08 writes: Iasmos, without a full set of auric afflictions, the mana and ego drains do not take effect, so there's no need to worry about that. These solutions would *only* affect a target that has been fully loaded up with aurics and hit by an 8p Chord. When pretty much any other class expends this much effort in setup and uses an 8p skill, their target dies (it's like killing via mana-instas without contemplation). Not to mention that people can just gust the bard out and require the bard to have to reafflict all over again. Currently, a lot of people can just tank the damage. And as for groups - the effectiveness of essentially every class scales synergystically as allies join (deepwounds, mana/ego instas, etc). ---on 3/9 @ 20:12 writes: Either solution would work really as allowing the manabarbs and egovice to count as damage would essentially one shot anyone but the tankiest surged warrior based on current numbers. Preference would be on solution #2. ---on 3/10 @ 08:21 writes: I really don't think that discordantchord needs an upgrade. The stun is far from 'brief', it usually allows for 1-2 more minorsixths before the target can start curing again. And considering the speed of the music skills that cause auric afflictions, things could get quickly out of hand if dischordantchord was an instant kill in almost all cases. Also, 16 power are a fairly moderate power expense to kill someone. ---on 3/10 @ 09:17 writes: That power and time costs rise rapidly when you consider that you basically have to reapply everything every time the opponent: 1. moves you from the room, 2. moves out of the room, 3. delays you long enough to eat a single horehound, 4. uses an active power cure, and 5. each time a passive curing/allheale-like ability potentially cures an auric (That's right, success is reliant on pure luck and guesswork). Then consider that the mana/ego drain hurts the bard for any followup minorsixths. It's an unwieldy skill that currently doesn't kill people (agreed by all of the people against the upgrades, above) and functions as a glorified stun even when it does work. ---on 3/10 @ 19:28 writes: A glorified stun for 16 power, too. Octave doesn't prevent curing via allheale and all other non-horehound cures, except for the Healing skillset. Celest RUB PHIAL and Aquamancy Sweetfount, Aeromancy Westwind, Pyromancy RAISE STAFF, Cacophony Vileblood, Night Drink... the list goes on and on. All of these reset the bard's offense, many of them passively. If someone shields when they eat earwort, they have time to recover herb balance and eat horehound before the bard can blanknote once to strip the shield and then again to strip earwort, which, again, means you have to start over. That's right, a skill at Inept in a Common Skill stops a bard's offense right in its tracks. If a person escapes the room, you lose three power from perfectfifth, and unless they willingly re- enter, you lose another three power from using Octave again. Eating earwort and initiating a tumble attempt at the same time means no matter how quickly the bard blanknotes, you'll still leave the room when the tumble goes through, even if you're not deaf anymore, not to mention Gust as an escape method... and even if you work your way through this, DiscordantChord doesn't even deal enough damage to kill anyone with over about 4000 health. Discordantchord is far from "not needing an upgrade"... ---on 3/10 @ 21:50 writes: Also, I'd support solution 1, with a slight change to have non-full discordantchords drain mana and ego based on percentage and give stun, the stun length and amount of mana and ego drained scaling with the number of aurics and the powercost. Right now, only full discordantchord is ever used, and the rest are kinda useless, and I'd like the whole "scaling-with-aurics" mechanic to actually get some use. ---on 3/16 @ 17:05 writes: Please note that scaling the drains with aurics is completely separate from dealing health damage via manabarbs and egovice. The former is much more acceptable to me than the latter. ---on 3/17 @ 02:39 writes: Well, of course it would. A drain that does not trigger manabarbs or egovice is helpful to the target, not the bard, since it lowers the potential drain pool (even more so when people opt to not use bromides). We're trying to say here that it's a bit silly to have the only drain ingame that is detrimental (no manabarb/egovice trigger) to bardic offense be from our theoretically strongest skill. I should mention that only the Octave holder would be able to cause manabarb/egovice to trigger in this fashion, as for some bizarre reason if any other bard DiscordantChords the target in this situation, all aurics would be consumed. ---on 3/17 @ 11:23 writes: Yes, but you're asking for the order of things to be changed so that the aurics are consumed only after they've dealt damage, and that's the part with which I disagree. ---on 3/18 @ 07:30 writes: No, it seems that's where the misunderstanding is then. If the caster holds Octave, the aurics *are still present on the target* after the Discordantchord is complete, allowing followup minorsixth drains without any reafflicting needed. This implies that the aurics are present on the target for the drain from the DChord, but simply do not trigger for some reason. ---on 4/30 @ 08:52 writes: Why not just cause partial discordants to fail with no power cost or aurics consumed? That would alleviate the problem of wasting power for a half-effective discordantchord.